Thanksgiving Conversations, Part 2

[0:00] is Religion and Politics at the Holiday Dinner Table, Part 2. We'd like you to please turn to Chapter 5 in the book of Ephesians.

[0:20] Again, Ephesians Chapter 5, and we'll be looking at verses 1 through 14. Therefore, be imitators of God as beloved children, and walk in love, just as Christ also loved you and gave himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma.

[0:53] But immorality or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints.

[1:09] And there must be no filthiness and silly talk or coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks.

[1:23] For this you know with certainty, that no immoral or impure person or covetous man who is an idolater has an inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.

[1:41] Let no one deceive you with empty words. For because of these things, the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.

[1:56] Therefore, do not be partakers with them. For you were formerly darkness, but now you are light in the Lord.

[2:09] Walk as children of light. For the fruit of the light consists in all goodness and righteousness and truth.

[2:21] Trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord. Excuse me. Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them.

[2:44] For it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret. But all things become visible when they are exposed by the light.

[2:58] For everything that becomes visible is light. For this reason it says, Awake, sleeper, and arise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.

[3:14] It is quite a passage, to say the least, and I have been enamored with the implications, particularly, of verse 11, and exactly how that is to be carried out.

[3:33] It's something that I've been exercised about for quite some time, and I can't say that I've ever arrived at a real satisfactory and full handle regarding it. We may or may not today.

[3:45] I do want to remind you that this is actually, not the second, but it is really the third in this brief series that we are dealing with concerning politics and religion.

[3:57] And a couple of weeks ago, and that would have been in session number one of this particular series, the subject was brought up regarding discussions around the Thanksgiving dinner table, which is upon us in just a few days, and how it is that many families put the subjects of politics and religion off the table.

[4:23] And those are items that you just do not discuss at a family setting like that. And the reason being, of course, there are some strong convictions held by those who are in attendance, usually, and they vary all the way from A to Z.

[4:40] And the likelihood is that if the family gets to discussing politics, and half of the place are Democrats, and the other half are Republicans, and a couple of independents thrown in, who knows what kind of a Donnybrook you're going to have.

[4:54] In addition to that, there are social issues like global warming, and like homosexual marriage, and all kinds of issues like that, over which people have some pretty strong opinions.

[5:07] So it is entirely possible that tempers will flare, names will be called, relationships may be injured, or even ended, all because of what should be a pleasant, enjoyable time at the Thanksgiving dinner table.

[5:22] But it turns out to be anything but that. And my suggestion to that is, if those who are participating in that dinner table exercise the kind of spiritual maturity that there ought to be, then tempers will not flare, but opinions and expressions and ideas can be honestly expressed, and honestly dealt with, and honestly disagreed with, all in a spirit of good camaraderie, and respect for each other's position, even though you don't agree with it, and everybody still leaves on speaking terms, rather than saying, well that's the last family dinner I'm coming to here.

[6:04] And not only that, but it's entirely possible, if the adults get all riled up, and fussing, and carrying on like that, what are the children present supposed to think?

[6:18] It's impossible for them to have no opinion, and children could be not only disillusioned, but sometimes terrified, especially if they see Uncle Frank stand up and make his statement, and you can see the veins in his neck pop out, and he's really angry about whatever it is he's talking about.

[6:36] Children have a difficult time processing that, and quite frankly, children ought not to be exposed to it. So after having made my statements about religion and politics being the two most important things, let me just touch on that a moment, and I'm going to open it for the floor.

[6:53] But we talked about politics and religion as being the most important issues that can be discussed, and I still feel that way.

[7:06] I have not changed my mind about that at all. But politics is the very sphere that governs all of our temporal lives.

[7:18] Like it or not, you can't escape that. It is. And it doesn't make any difference where you live, what part of the world, or what language you speak. That's true all over the world because politics is a characteristic of humanity.

[7:32] So politics is the very sphere that governs all of our temporal lives on a day-to-day basis. Religion, and I use that term ill-advisedly, but I use it because the world is more familiar with it, but religion is the very sphere that governs all of our eternal lives.

[7:55] Okay? And I do not think that is really subject to dispute because it is a reality. Religion is the sphere that governs all of our eternal lives forever and ever, and that includes, of course, the plan of salvation and receiving Christ and everything that goes with it.

[8:15] So there is no subject more important than these, or broad, or expansive, or critical. Therefore, nothing should be more legitimate for family dinner table gatherings.

[8:31] But, as I've already mentioned, there is a caveat, caveat. And for you youngsters who are here, that might be a new word for you. It's a word from the Latin.

[8:44] And a caveat, C-A-V-E-A-T, means, the dictionary tells us, a caveat is a warning in joining one from certain acts or practices.

[8:57] It is an explanation to prevent misinterpretations. And when you use that word caveat and put another Latin word with it, emptor, caveat emptor, many business people are familiar with that.

[9:12] A caveat emptor is a principle in commerce without a warranty whereby the buyer takes the risk. So someone says, well, I'm thinking about buying that car.

[9:25] And another person pops up and says, well, caveat emptor, which means let the buyer beware. Because along with that car being sold, it is being advertised as, as is.

[9:41] No refunds, no exchanges. That's the caveat emptor. You need to know what you're getting into. Because if it turns out to be something that you don't like, you're stuck with it.

[9:52] You cannot return it. So it is a warning in advance. And if you go to a sale and you see something has a sign on it that says, as is. That means maybe it's not all there.

[10:04] Maybe it's partially broken or something like that. And they're giving you a warning up front that if you buy this, there's no recourse and there's no exchange.

[10:15] So, when you say there is a caveat with discussing these subjects around the family dinner table, that means it comes with a warning. It could turn out to be very upsetting instead of enlightening.

[10:29] And it could actually create a cleavage in the lives of some of those people that ought not to be separated like that. And they're all coming from a position of good faith and of honesty and of genuine convictions.

[10:45] But they really differ. So, there's no question about it. Matter of fact, I suspect that this coming Thanksgiving, there may well be across America, especially given what's taking place now in our country, particularly politically, I would not be a bit surprised if there aren't some serious divisions that are created by dinner table conversations this year.

[11:13] And if that is suspected, I think it would be entirely proper for everybody to agree. Well, let's use a different venue for this because we want our Thanksgiving dinner to be an occasion of gratitude to God whereby the whole of those seated around the table can be in unison and in agreement as to God's provision, et cetera.

[11:39] And if these things that I've talked about cannot be discussed in the manner in which they should, they'd be better off not being discussed at all rather than to ruin the whole event.

[11:49] So, that's where we left it. And that's what I mean when I say there is a warning to be connected with that. And as I first elaborated on this, I took a more stringent position and my sweet little darling daughter in the fashion of her mother called me out on that.

[12:17] And I told the folks the following Sunday that I've modified my position on that. So, my position is what I just gave you. But I still have a problem with verse 11 of chapter 5 and that is the exposure of unfruitful deeds of darkness that still needs to be done.

[12:38] It doesn't need to be done at the Thanksgiving dinner table. but it does need to be done. And for the most part, most of us Christians, and I would include myself, have a lot to learn regarding that and need to crank up our courage in order to do it because most of us are just too timid to do it.

[12:59] But the admonition that is given here by the Apostle Paul in exposing the unfruitful deeds of darkness is not a suggestion. it's a command.

[13:11] It's an imperative. And the implication is failure to do so makes you negligent, disobedient. So, what does it mean to expose these things?

[13:23] It means literally to call them out. Ooh, how do you do that very carefully?

[13:33] And we'll be talking about that also a little bit later. So, having laid that as a very meager foundation for what we were discussing, I now want to turn to you and ask you for your comments as to whatever you may wish to add, detract, agree with, disagree with, or whatever, you are welcome.

[13:54] Who is our roving microphone? Where is he? She. Oh, okay. We are an equal opportunity microphone provider.

[14:08] Okay. Who has a question or comment? Just put up your hand and she will have the microphone right to you. Up here, in the front.

[14:18] What is your name, dear? Pardon me? Sophie. Sophie. Sophie. Okay. Okay, thank you. Thanks.

[14:31] Before my question, I need to provide a caveat. Okay. When people exchange ideas, it's very common to someone says something and the other person jumps in right away and tells their own viewpoint or tells, sometimes it even happens in stories.

[14:47] Oh, yeah, well, that happened to me and work very hard to listen to what the other person is saying rather than jumping in or interrupting or things like that.

[14:59] So, if you have listened to someone's viewpoint, is someone sharing a viewpoint, do you take that as an invitation to share yours?

[15:11] Because it seems to me that some people are more bold to share their viewpoint than others and they don't much care whether it's controversial or not, especially if they consider themselves a crusader to change.

[15:25] In the culture wars, it's to change what historically has been considered right and true. But we know that if we stand up for the biblical viewpoint, and they've already presented theirs, that there's going to be fireworks, if you will.

[15:42] So, is it, do you take someone's stepping out and sharing their viewpoint as an invitation after you've listened to share your own? Very good question.

[15:55] Now, who among you has the answer to that? Actually, like you said, it is barely an invitation, as it were.

[16:11] And let me put it this way. if no one has an expression or a sentiment to offer to counter that, then what is the assumption that you agree?

[16:26] You know, this is a real issue that's going on right now in Washington. And I'm sure that Jim is very much aware of it.

[16:37] what was the attitude, what was the attitude of past presidents when criticism and disagreement was lodged against them?

[16:50] Of course, there were always exceptions, but for the most part, what was the attitude? You just dummy up. You ignore it. And the implication, the common wisdom among many was that you don't even dignify their charge by defending yourself, because if you do, you just lower yourself to their level, and it's not worth it.

[17:20] But there is a caveat, and that is, if you do not answer or refute the accusation, what is the assumption?

[17:34] That it's true. That it's true. I know, I know Billy Graham, God bless him, had a tremendous problem with this, and one of his books I remember reading, he really struggled with that, and he was advised by others, and he ended up taking what was referred to as the high road.

[17:57] So you just ignore the criticism, and you don't pay any attention, you just act like they didn't say anything, you just ignore it. And that takes a lot of steel for a man, and I mean S-T-E-E-L, steel, to do that, because, especially when you know full well that it isn't true, and most of us are not comprised in such a way that we can allow that to go unchallenged, and the tendency is, when somebody criticizes or says something about you that you know is not true, and you do not refute it or deny it, they usually have little recourse other than to believe it's true.

[18:45] Well, did you hear such and such and so and so about so and so? No, I don't believe it. Well, he didn't deny it, so if you don't deny it, even if you aren't guilty, it makes you look guilty in the eyes of a lot, so there's both sides to that coin, and President Trump, guess which position he's taken?

[19:12] Well, you don't have to guess very far, but you know something? This man, love him or hate him, is from a completely different mold than the 44 presidents that's been there before, and the media in particular just doesn't know what to do with this guy or how to handle him because you know what?

[19:39] Let's be facing it now, let's be honest, the media has been historically an enormously controlling force.

[19:50] force, and if you don't believe that, I don't know what planet you're from, but do you know what? They're supposed to be. They're supposed to be if they print, and if the electronic outlet, if it portrays and broadcasts what is actually true, then people are informed with the truth, they can act accordingly, take positions accordingly, make decisions accordingly, and the media is doing what it's supposed to do.

[20:24] God bless them. That's their assignment. And traditionally, the media assignment has always been to strive for objectivity.

[20:37] security. And I think one of the watchwords or characteristics of that used to be when an anchor was giving a news report, you were simply unable to tell which side that guy was on, of what position he took, because he would cut it right down the middle with just trying to provide the facts, and then people can interpret that however they want.

[21:04] But nowadays, much of the media doesn't even attempt to be objective. They just crank out what they want people to believe.

[21:17] And of course, there are some exceptions, there always are, but in the main, this is exactly what's happening, and this is why it's been labeled fake news, because fake news is the opposite of real news, and real news is true, and fake news isn't.

[21:31] So anyway, I've got a comment back here. Yes. Yes, sir, thank you. We, in this congregation, looking around, we are all about the same generation as myself, and God bless him, Jim Jordan.

[21:53] We have watched the attitude that you are expressing, and that we just clam up for three generations now, and that has brought us to where we are now.

[22:10] So, when we're having the kind of discussions that you speak of, those discussions, for the most part, end up being with those that are of an opposite point of view, that have also, not also, that have been brought up in godlessness, as we watched our friends and brothers and sisters grow toward godlessness while we tried to stay in God's light, is what makes it so difficult to address those feelings in a family setting, or even amongst friends.

[23:00] We just had some dinner with some friends recently, that we didn't realize how far left, so to speak, they had gone.

[23:16] It's so hard to clam up, but you still do it. Of course, of course it is, sure. So, I guess my question is, during the last three generations, I feel like the vast majority of churches, this one being the exception, have chosen to clam up, that they've not been teaching God's people the simple economics of politics, and how God's people can, if I can coin a phrase, vote by remote.

[23:58] You don't vote just once or twice, occasionally, once every four years, or once every two years. The church has not been teaching God's people that you vote every day, with your remote control.

[24:14] people, and God's people don't understand that they're actually funding the devil's workshop with their viewership. It's not just tax money, it's not just your cable bill.

[24:29] They, when I was in school, as early as seventh grade, it was simple economics, even taught in a math or social studies class, that your viewership is actually enabling the devil's work.

[24:50] It certainly can be, and I appreciate you making that observation. That's what it is often, and that's, the old saying goes, all it takes for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing.

[25:03] And we've got a lot of do-nothing-ism in the country, and some of the do-nothing-ism is awakening. Yes, where was the comment?

[25:13] Gary, okay. Last Sunday, and Marv, you might recall, after I read last Sunday's scripture portion that you had given me, you then read another scripture portion, and that was in Ephesians chapter 4.

[25:54] chapter 4. And I think that when we're at a holiday dinner, we need to remember that Ephesians 4, 31, and 32, let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamor, and slander, be put away from you, along with all malice.

[26:37] And when we're talking to someone, look at verse 32, be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving each other, just as God and Christ also forgave you.

[26:58] Right. Okay. Thank you. And I could not agree with that more, but there is a caveat. And does anybody know what the caveat is? to whom is this passage addressed?

[27:15] Believers. Addressed to the Christian community. But you may have half of your expanded dinner table on Thanksgiving occupied by unbelievers who will not recognize the authority of those verses, and you say, well, this is from the Bible, and they might say, well, big deal, who cares?

[27:40] The Bible was just written by a bunch of old men in long gowns years ago. So, this comment, which is powerful, and ought to be everyday affair for believers, but it is unreasonable to expect to impose this attitude upon unbelievers.

[28:05] God knows we have enough trouble getting believers to live by it, right? Because believers can walk in the flesh, and if they do, they're not going to observe that either, because walking in the flesh doesn't mean that you're not going to exercise those qualities, and it is for a spirit-filled believer.

[28:24] So, there is every possibility that you're going to have a mixture. You know, families expand, enlarge, and marriage, you've got uncles and aunts and cousins and second cousins and whatnot, and these sometimes come together, and by the way, Thanksgiving, we are told by those who keep track of these things, that Thanksgiving is the most heavily traveled holiday of the year, not Christmas, but Thanksgiving.

[28:53] It's probably in part due to the fact that, you know, you kind of got a four-day weekend there, and that helps too. Okay, what do you have, Joe? Joe? It kind of goes along with the last two comment, speakers.

[29:09] I believe, and this is what I do, you know, this is what I do. I don't, you don't have to preach. I don't think the Bible says each one of us here that are disciples or saints, I want you to go out now and preach on the streets, you know, and take your body and convert.

[29:27] It's your life, you know, living your life, and what you say and do along with what Gary brought out in the Bible.

[29:39] And I think people then know where you are coming from, and they see you, and you see your life, and if they see something good, excuse me, in your life, you tend to, they tend to like your opinions and like what you say and so forth, because they kind of want to be like you.

[29:58] there's something, you have something, in the general discussions of anything and everything, if they see your happiness, your feeling of good, and like the start of our service, the beauty, you know, and you talk about the beauty you see, and you mention God frequently, because he's the one that gave it to us, in other words, it's your behavior in your overall workings and dealings with people that they see, and that's how you're going to win people, that's how they're going to want to know what you think more, and that's the time you have a chance to tell them that everybody is a sinner.

[30:40] You know, all men, like Jim is working with, in Congress, they're all sinners, and they all think they got it right, see, but they don't have it right, God's the only one that has it right.

[30:54] Okay. Somehow, man has to come to believe and know that God has it right, and so you've got to go by his word, the Bible, but that's the problem, is getting people to know where to go, where they can get it right.

[31:08] Okay, thank you, Jim, thank you, Jim, and I couldn't agree more about the importance of living a life. There's an old saying that goes something like this, what you do, speak so loud that the world can't hear what you say, and that puts the importance upon a godly life and a godly lifestyle.

[31:29] And every believer, I think, is under obligation to live an exemplary life for Christ, no question about it. And that's letting your light so shine that men may see your good works and glorify your Father that is in heaven.

[31:44] God's love. But at the same time, we are still under obligation to tell, to talk, to proclaim.

[31:59] And we don't have to use the word preach, but a believer who may never have stood behind a pulpit and maybe never will, still has the opportunity and the responsibility maybe not to preach, but at least to proclaim, to let it be known what the word is.

[32:18] Because it is through the proclamation, it pleased God through the foolishness of the thing preached, proclaimed, delivered, however, to save them that believe.

[32:33] So we have an obligation, and this is the harder part of the Christian faith. It is opening your mouth and saying something because most of us are too intimidated to say that.

[32:50] We think, well, I don't, I'm afraid they'll ask a question I can't answer, and I'll be embarrassed. I'm afraid that I'll come across wrong or that I will offend them.

[33:02] And there is that fear factor that lurks in the heart and mind, I think, of just about every believer that causes us to just clam up. We're afraid we won't say it well enough or we won't say it right, and we just hunker down and let it go.

[33:21] And what Paul is talking about in this Ephesian letter is to expose them, have nothing to do with the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.

[33:35] Now, you may be able to do some exposing just by living a consistent godly life before them, but it's going to take a long, long time to do that, and we still have this gospel to communicate.

[33:51] And when it comes to living the life, someone has said that a believer in Jesus Christ should so live his life and conduct his affairs that if men speak evil of you, no one will believe them.

[34:09] Now, that's admirable, and you know, that's the way we all ought to live. But just living the life is not enough. God forbid that we not live the life and just mouth the words, because if we give out a message, if we give out the words without living the life, that's worse.

[34:31] That's worse than saying nothing, far worse. That's hypocritical, you know, where you say one thing, but you live a life that expresses something else. The world doesn't need that. There's enough of that out there already.

[34:43] So we're talking about a really important, very important, but complex thing. And it's nothing more than the simple communication of the gospel.

[34:55] And when you expose people, how can you expose people? When he says that we are not to have anything to do with the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.

[35:08] You can't expose them by living the life, I don't think, unless you are convinced that they're going to make a constant comparison between you and what they're doing. And there's truth in that, and that may be an element, but it's going to take a long time to do it.

[35:21] And the exposure, the exposure has to do with vocalizing, talking, with telling. And what it is that we are obligated to tell is the truth.

[35:35] That's the light. Let's read on the rest of that text, if we may. Ephesians chapter 5, when he says, Do not be partakers with them.

[35:46] Verse 8, you were formerly darkness, but now, as opposed to then, now you are light in the Lord. Walk. There's your walk. There's your manner of life, which is very important.

[35:58] Walk as children of light, for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness and righteousness and truth. If you're cranking out those things, they're going to notice. It may take a while, but they're going to notice.

[36:10] Trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord, and do not participate, go along with, in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead, even expose them.

[36:24] For it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret. Now, what could those things be? If they are so disgraceful that I, your pastor, am reluctant to talk to you about them in mixed company, that ought to tell you it's pretty bad.

[36:50] It's pretty bad. disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret. But, but, all things become visible when they are exposed by the light.

[37:05] For everything that becomes visible is light. What is the light supposed to be, and where is the light supposed to come from? It's supposed to come from you and me.

[37:17] This is, let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works and glorify your Father in heaven. For this reason it says, and here is an admonition to the unbeliever.

[37:29] Awake sleeper, this is one who is spiritually asleep. It's not somebody who's sleeping eight hour variety a night. It's not talking about sleeping overnight. It's talking about being spiritually asleep, needing to be awakened.

[37:42] Arise from the dead, spiritually dead, and Christ will shine on you and will provide the light that you need to be regenerated. That's what he's talking about.

[37:52] That's what the whole passage is talking about. So, therefore, be careful how you walk. People are watching. Not as unwise men, but as wise, making the most of your time because the days are evil.

[38:11] And then he talks about don't be drunk with wine and dissipation and so on. Who else has a comment or question? Appreciate your input here. Up front here. You do a good job with that microphone.

[38:26] Just as good as the boys. Maybe when a comment is made, made at a holiday table, and you disagree with it, maybe the best response is to simply say, I don't agree with that.

[38:48] I pray about this situation, and I know that God's will will be done. And then after the meal at some other time, if they want to pursue a discussion with you, but at least you have taken a position, and it's been a loving position, and you've interjected your faith.

[39:11] Okay, well I appreciate that response on your part, that you don't agree with that, but however you have no control. What do you mean you don't agree with it?

[39:24] You may run into that too, but your thought is valid. I appreciate that. I appreciate that. Yes, in the back. you have your physical family, and then you have your spiritual family, like you mentioned before.

[39:45] Yeah. And the experiences that you have in common with your family give you a bond, but the experiences you have with your spiritual family, mainly salvation, is what gives you an eternal bond.

[39:59] True. And that is what I think affects core values, which kind of indicates maybe what side of the political spectrum you might be on.

[40:13] Yeah, yeah. Excellent. Good point. Both of those are realities, and at most dinner tables, let me put it this way, at most large dinner tables, you will almost always have a mix.

[40:29] you will have some who are believers, and you'll have probably some who are not. And nobody, certainly no Christian, ought to deliberately make someone feel uncomfortable or offend someone, because you know they're not a believer, and you don't want to ostracize them, you don't want to, I hate to use that word offend, because it's so overused by the world today, who doesn't want to offend anybody about anything.

[41:02] That's crazy too. But we don't want to take advantage of someone in their position by bad-mouthing them or their position, or ridicule, or anything.

[41:15] Here's where the kindness factor comes in. It doesn't make any difference with whom you are dealing, whether they are believers, or unbelievers, or atheists, or homosexual, or whatever.

[41:28] We have absolutely no right to treat anyone unkindly. We owe everyone kindness and consideration and respect.

[41:41] And I've made a distinction about this before. We need to respect everyone simply because they are made in the image and likeness of God.

[41:53] and that means they are worthy of our respect. That does not mean that we are obligated to agree with them in their positions because there is a huge difference between respecting someone and respecting what someone believes.

[42:11] And I've heard it said before and I cringe when I hear it. I even hear people, even hear Christian people say this. You need to respect everyone's belief. No, you don't.

[42:22] No, you don't. You need to respect everyone. But if you know they believe error, untruth, you have no right and you have no cause to think that you owe some kind of respect to what you know to be a lie.

[42:39] You don't. You owe respect to people, but not to positions that people hold, especially if you know them to be untrue. So there is a difference between respecting the person and respecting the person's belief.

[42:54] When you, when someone says, well, I'm convinced that there is no God. Well, I respect that. No, I don't. I respect you, but I cannot respect the position that you hold because I'm convinced that there is a God.

[43:11] So there is a clear-cut, legitimate difference between the respect and the kindness that we owe to the individual as opposed to the respect that we do not owe to what we understand to be error.

[43:25] Someone else? Okay. In the back, over here. Put your hand up, Bill.

[43:39] Okay. I was wondering if we could come at disagreements through the confines of a marriage relationship.

[43:59] Sometimes, like, if you go into a marriage thinking you're absolutely sure about your position, I don't know about you folks, but that doesn't go well over in my family.

[44:10] And if a man goes into a conversation, let's say, with someone who disagrees with someone at the table, for instance, I don't know of many married men, anyway, that hasn't been kicked in the shins by his wife under the table.

[44:31] In other words, you can't go into a situation thinking you have a monopoly on what's right. Yeah. Because if you do, I mean, there again, in the confines of marriage, sometimes those relationships get pretty chilly.

[44:49] Yeah. And, but what happens in that relationship is that you, sometimes you get to a situation where you agree to disagree, but by the time nightfall hits, you kiss and make up.

[45:04] Yeah. And now whether, and I use that, but whether you're the board of elders, whether you're in a family, I mean, you're going to disagree. And sometimes it's your responsibility to disagree.

[45:16] You know, who's going to pick the kids up tonight after, well, it's not going to be me. I've got a, I got a ball game, you know, to watch. Well, you know, you've got different things that you have to put in a certain priority.

[45:26] You know, not to take, I know it's 1130 or, you know, shortly after. I'll be quick. But another, another thing is, just as I had mentioned, you can't come into a relationship thinking, I'm sure about everything.

[45:44] But there are bits and pieces and slices of what people think that eventually you make a pretty decent, or you try in a way to make a pretty decent decision.

[45:56] Yeah. All of these home and marriage relationship types of comments, maybe that's why they call it the house. But anyway, you know, as I mentioned, you know, you can't come at situations thinking that you're right about it all, but you can't come to them thinking that there is nothing that you have to say that doesn't have credibility as well.

[46:23] You know, and as I mentioned, you know, as far as the Thanksgiving theme goes, I think if we go about knowing that you can't be absolutely so sure of your position, that you can't respect the position of someone who may counter you in what they have to say.

[46:46] I appreciate that. Thank you. Brilliant. Brilliant enough to be my son-in-law. Okay, we'll take one more and then we'll be out of time, but thank you for your input.

[46:59] I hate to be the last one, but I read this morning that Chick-fil-A decided not to support Salvation Army, the Fellowship of Christian Athletes, and there was one other one that they, you know, donate to because of pressure from the social justice warriors to, you know, not be doing that or not treating them fairly or something, and I sure hope he recants.

[47:36] Yeah. Well, this has become a very volatile issue, whether one supports or does not support the LGBT coalition.

[47:55] It's the alphabet. Yeah, the alphabet. And they are making tremendous inroads, and I know our time is gone. I'm not going to try to elaborate on that.

[48:07] But I would just say that that the distinctions that are held by these folks may well be, may well be America at the edge and going over.

[48:28] Because you cannot get any more basic in human existence than maleness and femaleness. and when those entities are compromised or disowned or replaced with some substitute, I cannot help but believe in the creator's mind, you are on really thin ice.

[48:53] And that may be, that may be America's last hurrah. It could well be. We could be facing a kind of repeat of Sodom and Gomorrah just on a larger scale.

[49:11] Because you can read the account, you'll find it in Genesis 19. This is really very, very serious stuff. That in the beginning, he made them male and female.

[49:25] Well, big deal. We can change that if we want. We can be what we want. We can marry whom we want. That makes no difference. And I cannot escape the concept that it is thumbing one's nose in the face of God.

[49:38] And I just don't know how long his long suffering is. But it's something to think about. We'll be talking about this more as time goes on. But for now, we are concluding. And I do want to thank you all for your input.

[49:50] I think your comments have been very helpful. And we will still wrestle with the implications of that verse exposing them. And any light that you might want to shed on it privately and share with me would be most appreciated.

[50:06] Meanwhile, I trust that you will all have a blessed Thanksgiving with whomever you are, wherever you are, and that you will remember the one who is responsible for it all, regardless of whatever your political or religious beliefs may be.

[50:22] Would you stand, please? Our Father, we are truly grateful for the existence and the ability to discover that which is true.

[50:35] And we heartily confess that there is so much error swarming about us as it has from Genesis 3 on to the present.

[50:46] And yet, to counter the error, you have provided incredible light. For the entrance of your word does give light.

[50:57] How grateful we are who have had that light to shine upon us, who responded to it, and removed us from darkness and delight. We shall forever be grateful.

[51:08] And we trust that we will take that responsibility and the gratitude that we should feel for it to such an extent that we will be eager to share that light with others, even as one day someone shared it with us.

[51:27] To that end, we ask your blessing upon us as we dismiss. In Christ's name, amen. Thank you.